The Fall Of Numenor

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Harper
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The Fall Of Numenor

Post by Harper »

I saw that this just came out:

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https://www.amazon.com/dp/006328068X?ps ... yp_imgToDp


Did you guys hear about this?

I gotta think that Amazon new about this and could have hired these guys to improve their extremely disappointing series.
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Elleth
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Re: The Fall Of Numenor

Post by Elleth »

My copy showed up this last week - I'd completely forgotten about it, but must have had it on preorder. From skimming it so far - it's not a Christopher Tolkien book, by which I mean it's not original drafts and notes assembled by one intimately familiar with the Professor and his work. So to that extent, the similar presentation with the recent "Beren and Luthien," "Children of Hurin," etc is a bit deceptive. This is the work of a third party combing through previously published material, and presenting it as a coherent linear history.

It's still very much worth it I think, especially for those with Dunedain personae - this format is much more digestible than bits and pieces scattered across all of Histories of Middle Earth. But best to know what you're getting ahead of time.
Persona: Aerlinneth, Dúnedain of Amon Lendel c. TA 3010.
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Harper
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Re: The Fall Of Numenor

Post by Harper »

Thanks.

I kind of figured that it was something like that.

But it is good to hear from somebody who actually has the book.
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Re: The Fall Of Numenor

Post by Bill25 »

The book looks pretty interesting. But let's wait to see some feedback.
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Re: The Fall Of Numenor

Post by Udwin »

I'm #4 in line to get my local library's copy, so I have to wait a while yet to read. Personally while I prefer Nasmith's illustrations, I'm always up to see Lee's interpretations. I heard an interview with Brian Sibley (the editor) recently, who said the Notion Club Papers were Not included, and (iirc) the Lost Road too. I'm very curious to see how Tal-Elmar is handled, and if the more recent material from NoMe is included.
Personae: Aistan son of Ansteig, common Beorning of Wilderland; Tungo Brandybuck, Eastfarthing Bounder, 3018 TA; a native Man of the Greyflood, c.850 SA
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Re: The Fall Of Numenor

Post by Udwin »

I have a sneaking suspicion that the timing of the book's release was intended to coincide with the end of the first season of The Amazon Show (which is actually a positive, so new fans can see what the authentic Second Age looks like).

Well, I was able to get my library's copy right before the holidays and read through it over winter break. If you've read this fall's Edge of the Wild, it's probably safe to say that I'm not the target audience for this book. I actually skimmed right through big chunks, like the Aldarion and Erendis chapters (which are always a slog), and some of the essays from NoMe, which I've recently been typing up for parsing and so are still fresh on my mind.

This is FAR from an 'All the Second Age Material Compendium'. While ambitious, it is largely a cut-and-paste collection, with artificial headings inserted to break up longer essays (such as 'Lives of the Numenoreans' from NoMe). However, some things are still conspicuously missing. You'd think the material addressing the Line-of-Elros-lack-of-beards would be included, but I didn't see it - the section 'On Appearance and Health' would be the perfect spot to mention it, but...nothing. (Alan Lee seems not to have gotten the message as his kings are still quite hirsute).
Since the Notion Club materials are not included, the section 'On Language' (dealing with Adunaic) actually contains zero Adunaic.
Tal-Elmar is only referenced in an endnote, where Sibley suggests it might show the very first arrival of the Numenoreans (in 600 SA). (There is such a variance between the 'helpful teacher' Numenoreans and the scary ones referred to in TE because the latter are from the very late SA and are under the Shadow...a fact which seems to go right over Sibley's head.)

At the same time, he includes the Numenor chapters from The Lost Road as an appendix!, which are very shaggy (no effort is made to alter the names to bring them in line with the later narrative) and which I had a very hard time getting through...I find that 'first draft Tolkien' is so fond of rambling conversations and general chatter that goes nowhere - see not only Tal-Elmar but also the first phase of LR.

Organizationally, I realize that HoMe and History of the Hobbit have spoiled me, as both of them present a passage, with any footnotes to be addressed in a 'Notes' section immediately following the passage, and then commentary on the passage as a whole. Sibley instead puts his footnotes at the end of the book, so you have to flip back and forth much more to read them. I actually much prefer Mohn's method of citation used in Middle-earth Seen By the Barbarians, which does away with footnotes altogether in favor of simple abbreviations in parentheses to cite each source. Since that is in effect a work of paraphrasing disparate snippets into a cohesive whole (what I'd hoped FoN would be), he is less beholden to keeping entire chunks of Tolkien's words intact. With a work like this, combining the two approaches would actually work really well - parentheticals could cite a line's source, saving the footnotes for actual commentary.

There is also little heed paid to the various conflicting drafts - thinking especially of the stories of Galadriel, Celeborn, Amdir, and Amroth. By my count, Tolkien was on 'Galadriel 4.0' when he died, but Sibley tries to present 2.0(?) as more definitive. I would really have appreciated spotlighting the issue, perhaps with a table showing the evolution between the various versions.

A nice map of Numenor (by CT but colored by Nicollete Caven) is included, but it's oriented in 'landscape' on a 'portrait' page, so it's fairly small and there's a lot of wasted blank page; rotating it to fill the page would allow for a much higher level of detail. The red/black map of 3A Middle-earth on the last page is so small it's almost a joke...the larger colored one by CT on the endpapers however is lovely.
Lee has never been my favorite Tolkien illustrator (his work is generally too light for me, lacking weight), but his Numenorean ships are very nice, especially in color.

I'm afraid I come off as far too critical in my review!...I guess I was expecting something more like Hammond & Scull in the Reader's Companion, who aren't afraid to pull from wider sources to get a fuller picture and actually seem to have something to say, versus this very basic 'presentation of published texts'. Like I said, for someone who has only read LR or the Hobbit and wants to dip their toe into the Second Age and see what all the fuss is about, this is still definitely a solid choice.
Personae: Aistan son of Ansteig, common Beorning of Wilderland; Tungo Brandybuck, Eastfarthing Bounder, 3018 TA; a native Man of the Greyflood, c.850 SA
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