Middle Earth Ranger Forum

Hi all,

Since Orcrist is getting so much attention on the forum I thought to post some pics I found around the web so that we can get a better idea of the sword and maybe the thought process the design.











Any thoughts, ideas and discussions welcome!

Ken

I still dislike that design. Looks like an Elven falchion.

I'm sorry, but I have to go against the prevailing opinion. I think it looks freakin' awesome. It makes me wish that United would make actual real swords instead of wallhangers when they make the replicas, 'cause I wants me that bad boy! Just sayin'.

See in and of it's self it's fine, but as Orcrist is the sister sword of Glamdring it should look atleast a little bit like Glamdring.

kaelln wrote:I'm sorry, but I have to go against the prevailing opinion. I think it looks freakin' awesome. It makes me wish that United would make actual real swords instead of wallhangers when they make the replicas, 'cause I wants me that bad boy! Just sayin'.

United actually does make real swords. As of right now I can score you a museum line glamdring made form carbon steel, heat treated and all, for $399.99 sans the box and coa. It's full tang and can hold an edge. I'm hoping they revive the line when The Hobbit hits theaters. If that happens you may get your wish after all.

As for the design of the sword, I now like it even less. it looks like a cross between a Falcata and a Dussak. The guard on the cutting side of the sword serves almost no purpose and overall the design just looks out of proportion. IMHO, It in no way bares anything but a passion resemblance to the fine and graceful lines of the original Lyons Glamdring design.

I do happen to like the look. I'll admit I was somewhat skeptical with the early pictures. but it really looks like it will cleave Orcs and that's the point isn't it?

It's got reach and a weight forward design, perfect for a powerful race with a lower center of gravity.

Peter Remling wrote:I do happen to like the look. I'll admit I was somewhat skeptical with the early pictures. but it really looks like it will cleave Orcs and that's the point isn't it?

It's got reach and a weight forward design, perfect for a powerful race with a lower center of gravity.

See that's one of the problems right there it's Elven work not Dwarven, so it shouldn't look like it was made for a Dwarf.

It is actually very much within the family stylistically of Sting, which I feel it is supposed to be more of a relation too.
I could see the Glamdring being a sister as in it may have been made by the same smith but it falls in line better with Sting for all that.

Do I like it? Well I am kinda on the fence still but it may grow on me, I am much more partial to Fili's twin seaxes myself!

Ringulf wrote:It is actually very much within the family stylistically of Sting, which I feel it is supposed to be more of a relation too.
I could see the Glamdring being a sister as in it may have been made by the same smith but it falls in line better with Sting for all that.

Do I like it? Well I am kinda on the fence still but it may grow on me, I am much more partial to Fili's twin seaxes myself!

I'll have to agree to disagree here. Tolkien says himself that Orcrist and Glamdring were related, but makes no mention of sting beyond being a long dagger fit as a sword for a hobbit. Calling them "mates to the other" implies a symmetry of design. There's no mention of Sting having such relation to either weapon so for them to draw from sting is a little off base. The sword is also not in line with Lyons other designs of Elvish origin. It's clearly meant for a dwarf where it was never meant to be so in the books. If they gave Peter Lyons as much freedom as they did for LOTR then I'm going to have to conclude he just dropped the ball on this one.

mcapanelli wrote:

Ringulf wrote:If they gave Peter Lyons as much freedom as they did for LOTR then I'm going to have to conclude he just dropped the ball on this one.

Five bucks says he was told that it needed to be designed with a dwarf in mind. It's a great weapon from the design-perspective of made-for-dwarf function...the problem is, according to the books, it wasn't.

I'd have been happy with a Glamdring clone that was shorter, and a bit more tip-heavy like the current Orcrist is, without the whole kopis-look.

Some bladesmith is going to make a fortune on a more book-appropriate Orcrist.

I am wondering if it is a holdover from ideas that Guillermo del Toro had for the films before he dropped out. Pj would have had final approval anyway, but from a film standpoint I agree that it looks to be designed so that it is used by Thorin. I guess we can retcon and say that, while made by an Elvish smith, it was for an unnamed Dwarf of the First Age.

Edit: After searching a bit, I keep reading that Peter Lyon is quoted as saying that they went for the single edge design because of the cleaver in the name, as they took is as single edged, and it seems that they are intentionally implying that Sting may be related to Orcrist as well since it shares properties with it and Glamdring.

Ken

Weren't Biter and Beater supposed to be veterans of the Goblin wars anyway?

Peter Lyon wouldn't be the one designing the weapons for the movies(atleast not by himself), the concept artists a Weta would be, but usually it's after getting notes from what the director wants. What most likely happened is Peter said he wanted a big single edge sword because that's the way he pictured it when he first read the books. I'm on the fence with this design; as a fan of the books I would have prefered it being more like Glamdring in style, but I do like the way it looks taken out of that context. I think it fits well in the movie world as it shows how elven sword design went from double edged leaf blades in the first age to single edge cutting blades in the later ages.

I am in agreement with the fact that they are sister blades and elven made. But they were built for the goblin wars so does'nt that suggest that one or the other could have been made for a dwarf?
And if you think about the many smiths in real life that you know, even if they seem to have a similar feel or signature, are they all the same style?
If I were making a chopping weapon for a dwarf even if I were an elf, I would make it to their requirements with my skill not the other way around.

Thus, Related, yet visually different, I don't think we have to have quite as tight a focus.... Vast is the world of Tolkien and the wonders there in!