Weapon Descriptions of Middle-earth

[Mirimaran]

Hail Rangers!

Since the subject was brought up, I start the thread with the research I did last year on the barrow-blades that Tom Bombadil gave the hobbits in FOTR. Feel free to add, comment, and reply!
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Dagger of Westernesse

Descriptions

For each of the hobbits he chose a dagger, long, leaf-shaped, and keen, of marvellous workmanship, damasked with serpent-forms in red and gold. They gleamed as he drew them from their black sheaths, wrought of some strange metal, light and strong, and set with many fiery stones. Whether by some virtue in these sheaths or because of the spell that lay upon the mound, the blades seemed untouched by time, unrusted, sharp, glittering in the sun.

"Old knives are long enough as swords for hobbit-people", he said. "Sharp blades are good to have, if Shire-folk go walking, east, south, or far away into dark and danger." Then he told them that these blades were forged many long years ago by Men of Westernesse: they were foes of the Dark Lord, but they were overcome by the evil king of Carn Dum in the Land of Angmar.

"Few now remember them", Tom muttered, "yet some still go wandering, sons of forgotten kings, walking in loneliness, guarding from evil things folk that are heedless."

Fog on the Barrow-Downs, The Fellowship of the Ring, page 184 Ballentine edition
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"See!" cried Aragorn. "Here we find tolkens!" He picked out from the pile of grim weapons two knives, leaf-bladed, damasked in gold and red; and searching further he found also the sheaths, black, set with small red gems. "No orc-tools these!" he said. "They were borne by the hobbits. Doubtless the Orcs despoiled them, but feared to keep the knives, knowing them for what they are; work of Westernesse, wound about with spells for the bane of Mordor. Well, now, if they still live, our friends are weaponless. I will take these things, hoping against hope, to give them back."

The Departure of Boromir, The Two Towers, page 20 Ballentine edition
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"Here are some treasures that you let fall", said Aragorn. "You will be glad to have them back." He loosened his belt from under his cloak, and took from it the two sheathed knives.

"Well!" said Merry. "I never expected to see those again! I marked a few with mine, but Ugluk took them from us. How he glared! At first I thought he was going to stab me, but he threw the things away, as if they burned him."

Flotsam and Jetsam, The Two Towers, page 199 Ballentine edition
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...And behold! there lay his weapon, but the blade was smoking like a dry branch that has been thrust in a fire; and as he watched it, it writhed and withered and was consumed.

So passed the sword of the Barrow-downs, work of Westernesse. But glad would he have been to know its fate who wrought it slowly so long ago in the North-kingdom when the Dunedain were young, and chief among their foes was the dread realm of Angmar and its sorcerer king. No other blade, not though mightier hands had wielded it, would have dealt that foe a wound so bitter, cleaving the undead flesh, breaking the spell that knit his unseen sinews to his will.

The Battle of the Pelennor Fields, The Return of the King, page 131 Ballentine edition
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He drew his sword and looked at it, and the intertwining shapes of red and gold; and the flowing characters of Numenor glinted like fire upon the blade.

The Black Gate Opens, The Return of the King, page 186 Ballentine edition

Then Pippin stabbed upwards, and the written blade of Westernesse pierced through the hide and went deep into the vitals of the troll, and his black blood came rushing out.

The Black Gate Opens, The Return of the King, page 187 Ballentine edition
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[Gareth]

...

[Jim E]

the flowing characters of Numenor glinted like fire upon the blade.

Would those be Feanorian characters?
In Numenor Quenya was used on all official documents and king naming but I can't recall if they used tengwar or some sort of runes for the writing

Great topic and research Mirimaran!

[Eric C]

I am reading through the books with my wife and kids now. We are almost done with FOTR. It is slow going, but when I come across a description, I'll share it.
Thanks Mirimaran.
Eric

[Gareth]

...

[mcapanelli]

This was of a kind called eket: a short stabbing sword with a broad blade, pointed and two-edged, from a foot to one and a half feet long. [Author's note.] -Unfinished Tales

This is the quote from UT that inspired this thread. Thanks to Mirimaran for pointing it out.

I posted this image in another thread, but feel it fits the context.



I think of an eket as being close to a Kinjal/Qama, gladius, or one of the anthropomorphic Celtic short swords.

Thoughts?

I always imagined, given the connection the men of Westernesse had with the elves, and the elves love of nature, that the swords would have a leaf shaped blade, even if slightly. With that in mind I always felt it would be something close to a greek Hoplite sword in general shape and construction.

[Gareth]

...

[mcapanelli]

I always imagined, given the connection the men of Westernesse had with the elves, and the elves love of nature, that the swords would have a leaf shaped blade, even if slightly. With that in mind I always felt it would be something close to a greek Hoplite sword in general shape and construction.

Color me ignorant (Because I am), but I don't know the connection there is between the men of Westerness and the Dunadain. Are they both groups of Numenorians? If there's a connection, then I totally agree with you. If not then I think it would be a bit more open.

Also, what if it were of Dwarven design?

~G

Westernesse was the name for the men of Numenor in the common tongue. It was used also in the third age to describe the decedents of Numenor, otherwise known as the Dunadain. So Westernesse and Numenorians are in essence one and the same.

[Gareth]

...

[Eledhwen]

The Gladius Hispaniensis was leaf shaped in blade, probably copied from the Celtiberians. They are nearly identical in the blade.

I have one of each sort and in the latter case, one of bronze; they are very lovely, very much consistent with Elven methods I think.

I prefer shortswords over longswords anyway. I use them with a smallish round shield...very effective in close.

Siani

[mcapanelli]

Well then I agree with you. Since the daggers of the Barrow Downs were of a leaf shape that is a logical conclusion.

Though I wonder if the evolution of blade type would be a consideration. Even the Celts eventually adopted a more tapered blade style.

I think that, with the freedom inherent in "reenacting" fiction, we could have both. Think of it as a matter of time-line.

~G

I agree with the time line and evolution of the blade type. You have to think that when Numenor fell and the city was in the hands of the stewart, the elvish influence would have faded over time. By the time we get to the third age we would have seen blade types closer to that of Rohan emerging as the blood of Numenor was thinned and their influence waned. It's all conjecture of course until I can find something in the books to support my theory.

[Mirimaran]

Hi again all,

It's never a chore to talk about Tolkien, so no worries on this end for starting a thread on weapons or any other subject that is related to Middle-earth. I'm glad that so many of you want to discuss the subject, so let's see what we can get started on.

Concerning the barrow-blades, I do agree that it must be Quenya that Tolkien refers to as the flowing characters on Pippin's blade, in tengwar I would imagine as runes do not give the impression of flowing as does the tengwar. It is a valid question to ask as to the actual history of the blade how to consider the nationality of it's maker. Tolkien tells us that the maker was from the North-Kingdom, and that the Dunedain were foes of Angmar, so that gives us a good reference for when the blade was forged. I guess the question is, when did the Dunedain in the North start viewing themselves as subjects of Arnor and not dis-placed Numenorians? Would Aragorn had thought himself as a Numerorian? Consider that the blades were in a barrow, which lay in what was once Cardolan. How old were the blades then? And just consider the power of the words etched in those blades, the Witch-King himself was harmed by that one stroke, was that Elvish magic, or a spell from the glory of Numenor? So again we are back to the maker of the blades. Arnor was founded S.A. 3320. The Witch-King founds Angmar in T.A. 1300. The North-kingdom perishes T.A. 1974.

Somewhere in that 600 years is our maker of the barrow-blades. The nobility of the Dunedain had lifespans three times that of a man, so my guess is that we are dealing with a second generation Numenorian who was instructed by someone very familiar with Numenorian metallurgy and weapon making. Anyone else want to comment?

[Beornmann]

I have always been drawn towards rhe sword, Gúthwinë, "Battle Friend."

The Thain's Book: Weapons & Battle Gear

[Gareth]

...

[Mirimaran]

This was of a kind called eket: a short stabbing sword with a broad blade, pointed and two-edged, from a foot to one and a half feet long. [Author's note.] -Unfinished Tales

Getting back to this, United Cutlery is offering their SS reproduction of Sam's sword from FOTR:

http://www.entertainmentearth.com/prodi ... r=UC2614MC

and I think it fits exactly with the description provided by Tolkien of the eket. Mayhap Aragorn lent to Sam a very ancient piece of weaponry? Regardless, even in SS I'd buy the knockoff if it looked close to the UC version. We have a couple of the UC pieces and IMO they are overpriced.