Middle Earth Ranger Forum

---

Well, this certainly increases my fears about the Amazon series:

Amazon’s Lord of the Rings Series Rises: Inside The Rings of Power
https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/20 ... 0288698368

Notice how they characterize anybody who disagrees with their vision and actually prefers Tolkien's original vision as "trolls."

I'll still give it a chance.

Maybe Bezos will buy the Mona Lisa,next--and paint a mustache on it.

Yeah, my cautious optimism is getting more cautious and less optimistic. Still hoping to be surprised, but I doubt I'll watch at this point.

I'm encouraged that at least it's not going to be a Game of Thrones 2.0.

Rob

Ghostsoldier wrote: ↑Fri Feb 11, 2022 12:01 pm I'm encouraged that at least it's not going to be a Game of Thrones 2.0.

Rob

That's my one biggest point of excitement; the rating confirmations and descriptions that are now circulating.

I DO think the image they claim to be Durin looks pretty solid. Seems (so far) very in line with both Gimli and written descriptions of Dwarves...but we already saw the Kingdom-Hearts-sized Warhammer in the other photos, so there's still a caveat.

We will finally see the full glory of Khazad-dûm—the cavernous necropolis carved into the Misty Mountains, where, in Jackson’s The Fellowship of the Ring, Gandalf famously bellowed at the Balrog, “You shall not pass!” The show will explore that kingdom when it was still full of light, food, and music

I've gotta say, I am really looking forward to seeing the visual design here, if nothing else, the photo's that have been released so far look extremely AWESOME!

I hate to even weigh in on this but each new piece they reveal drives me further and further into the NO camp.

I have lots of small individual reservations but the latest trailer for me was the biggest issue. It just doesn't look or feel like any Middle Earth I know and I have spent my whole life in these books.

I know it's just a teaser trailer and I can kind of see some familiar events in there (I assume the ice climbing scene is Galadriel in the Helcaraxë) but it feels like some sort of generic fantasy trailer and not Middle Earth.
I went and watched the original theatrical trailers for the lord of the rings trilogy and it's chalk and cheese.

I get that casting and storyline will always be issues of contention but if you'll forgive me for expressing it so wistfully - Watching the trailer should feel like coming home or putting on an old comfortable jumper.

The trailer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7v1hIkYH24

it feels like some sort of generic fantasy trailer

This is exactly it.

It's not Tolkien - it's sloppy generic fantasy fan-fic with Tolkien's signature sloppily forged along the bottom.

Maybe one of the fan-edits can salvage enough to make something recognizable, maybe not*.
Regardless, I've no more interest in seeing the Amazon production than the last Azeroth movie, and for exactly the same reason.



* With the timeline savaging, probably not... at least until desktop-level video editors can do wholesale replacement of actors (and likely set design/weathering) so you can see the generations unfolding on Numenor.

In my humble opinion, this is the essence of “looking fair but feeling foul”. They’ve obviously sunk quite a bit of money into this but it looks cheap, boring, and nothing like Tolkien’s world. I’ve expressed my opinion of basing your kit on real-world history so I might be biased but all this looks like crappy fantasy schlock. Pop rivets, modern fabric, overly designed outfits, plate armor, and those infernal leather cuffs. The list could go on and I hate it all. At least the Jackson version tried, y’know? This looks like bad cosplay. It looks like fantasy honestly. I know it is supposed to be fantasy but the Professor based his world on real-life history and this ain’t it. Some nice wool fabric, better clothing designs (that T-shirt looking tunic annoys me to no end), veg-tan leather, and chain mail would go a decent way toward making this look better.

GAH. I just realized another great wasted opportunity...

Just imagine the subtle tip-of-the-hat nod you could do to Thomas Cole's Course of Empire series seeing Numenor go over the course of several seasons from the Arcadian State of Eru's gift and the first arrivals on an empty island to Destruction and the Akkalabeth.

All the while seeing the same elven characters popping through all those generations? Living with those elves as they see the same petty rivalries, the same selfish ambitions, the same stupid mistakes - all play out over and over and over?

Seeing men looking on elves with wonder and envy, knowing they're talking with someone who spoke with their great great great grandmother.
SEEING an elf interact with generations of a human family over seven seasons... and in the last season being present while the last of a line dies, and look to the stars, and wonder - where did they all go?

... while being stuck, here on Arda marred - forever.


All that potential just tossed away for another homogenized corporate product.

Good God what a travesty.

I'm gonna be the Devil's Advocate here, and will withhold my final opinion until I see it; in my humble opinion, some Tolkien in today's vast entertainment wasteland is better than no Tolkien (even if it has glaring missteps and some diversion from the True Path).

If nothing else, this interpretation will serve to bring new fans/disciples to the canon, where it can be fully explained and corrected to appear closer to what the Professor truly intended with his work.

Rob

...some Tolkien in today's vast entertainment wasteland is better than no Tolkien...

I think the problem is exactly that this is "no Tolkien."

Compressing the timeline is a staggeringly telling alteration - it shows the writers and showrunners have absolutely missed one of - if not the central theme in all Tolkien's work - mortality.

What is the source of Numenor's corruption, if not watching generations of your own rise and fall to dust - all while watching Eru's older children carry on seemingly untouched by time?

That one decision reduces every character to just another skin in a video game.

This isn't Tolkien's work.

This is generic fantasy clone #419-C with some names scratched out and replaced with purchased IP.

Maybe it could have even been entertaining in its own right, whatever that is.

But it's not Tolkien.

If it's any consolation (or a glimmer of hope), Bezos has already bankrolled 5 seasons of it... maybe in that timeframe they can elaborate on the deeper facets of the Professor's work that you highlighted, without losing the rather short attention span of the folks who are watching, and who may only be armchair enthusiasts.

After all, they are the one's paying Bezos' salary, lol, and he can't afford to lose the interest of the masses.

Rob

Tbh I think it depends on how the compression is done - I can see mortality still being a strong theme even if it's over say, a few hundred years and a half dozen or dozen generations of men in that time vs the what, thousands of years of the second age in the books? I think in a visual medium that may have been too much and got repetitive rather than thematic, leaving aside casting issues

If it's compressed so tightly to the point where mortality can't be a central theme anymore then yeah, that would absolutely suck

My biggest worry, which I've seen no-one mention in any critique, is that we will get that avengers-y, self aware/referential, ironic, quippy sort of dialogue that has seemingly taken over all media in the last decade. Tolkien is very much a sincere writer with sincere dialogue and I think that was carried over well in the OT

Eofor wrote: ↑Mon Feb 14, 2022 11:37 am but if you'll forgive me for expressing it so wistfully - Watching the trailer should feel like coming home or putting on an old comfortable jumper.

Yup. PJ had me at the mountain pass trailer on Fellowship. It felt right. This seems fairer and feels fouler, if you understand.

I think I too am with Ghostsoldier on this, I will be withholding my final opinion until I see it. You all know I am a movie person, and that I am very fond of The Hobbit trilogy despite all it's shortcomings, simply because dramatic action and stunning visual design are my thing, and this Amazon series from what I have seen so far looks like it will have all that, even if the story/costuming etc... are messed up